Hunter Out, Mickens In — Oh, Nevermind
Posted: April 28, 2005 @ 9:41 am
The fallout from the Aaron Glenn signing Wednesday became clear on Thursday. According to CB Pete Hunter’s agent, the Cowboys will ship the disgrunted Hunter to the New York Jets in exchange for veteran CB Ray Mickens.
The deal appears to be depth for depth. With Glenn on board, Hunter was facing the prospect of being the Cowboys’ fourth corner. In Mickens, Bill Parcells would be obtaining another familiar veteran from his Jets days. The nine year veteran will come with a risk; Mickens is recovering from an ACL tear that cost him the entire 2004 season. In this regard, the deal appears to as much a way of removing a headache in Hunter as it does a way of gaining veteran depth in the secondary.
Update: The DMN is now reporting that the Hunter-for-Mickens deal is dead, quoting Jets GM Terry Bradway as a source.
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Hunter……….the CB starter for what 4 games……..also had a knee injury and missed the rest of the season………..vs. a Nine Year Veteran…….that gives us more depth and experience at Corner to go along with Newman, Henry, Glenn and the Rookie Committee from last years draft………
Bye Bye Pete!!!!
Sounds like a win-win. We win even if Mickens isn’t 100% until late in the season. Hunter looked good at first but never really showed me enough to be “THE MAN” at the corner.
I don’t like it, but maybe there was no alternative.
Everything else being equal, a younger player like Hunter will recover faster from knee injury than a 9-year veteran.
I know Hunter may have been a real jackass, but don’t you want a CB in your locker room who gets pissed off when he loses his position. If his confidence was real and not manufactured by his agent, then I like it. I want a CB to believe that he can shut down receivers better than the next guy.
We had him under a contract, so he wasn’t going anywhere. I was hoping that his competitivness was going to a positive, but I guess BP and JJ decided it was more likely to be a distraction. Hunter blew a good thing.
The Dallas JETS,god damn it, enough with the Bill parcells ex old JET players…..
This is becoming more and more of a problem, you cant continue down this road of signing older thirty something and trading early twenty year old players.This is becoming the win now program.Short term thinking will get you another 5 years of 5-11 seasons to make one playoff run. At some point you have to develop some young players on your roster to start to take over the thirty year old players. Its becoming more apparent that Bill will not play younger players and dont give me this garbage, well you see what they do in practice. Practice is just what the word means, Practice,Let the young guy make the mistakes and let them learn from them. The speed in practice doesn’t translate in game time conditions.
I can see it now, A bunch of you will be on here whining in week two or three of the season, saying how come our draft pick dont get more playing time?, why did we draft them if they cant play?This guy must be a bust?Zimmer sucks and should be fired.etc,etc,etc.
players developed or developing so far in three years.Newman,Witten,Johnson,jones,williams.
Thats not enough,folks
Everyone else cant be trusted!!!!!!!!!!!!
Glad we have finally had a great draft and didn’t trade out of spots just to trade.
if hunter was going to bitch all season long and be a cancer its a good deal get whatever and rid ourselves of him, the downside is youth, hunter is young with alot of upside but has yet to show it.
I agree with Cooper…not sure whether I like this move, but it may be the best alternative. I just hate when players whine and dictate to try to get their way. Hunter should be grateful the Cowboys were willing to hand him the starting job last year. The team could have easily gone out and signed a veteran (Winfield, etc.) and made Hunter fight his way into the lineup. Seriously, what did Hunter do in ‘03 to earn the starting spot? He couldn’t beat out Mario Edwards and he played horribly in the slot, but they still gave him a chance. Then he goes down with an injury is out for the year and wants the Cowboys to keep his starting spot open even though he still hasn’t proven himself. What is he thinking? Now this year he had an opportunity to be the third corner (before signing Glenn) and/or be the starting free safety and he turns he nose up at it saying that “safety is a position corners play when they lose a step.” I like to see him say that to Roy Williams or Darren Woodson. What an ungrateful spoiled chump.
While it sucks to see the Cowboys invest 3+ years in a young player in hope that he may turn the corner and one day be a valuable asset to the team, I say good riddance Mr. Hunter. We don’t need fools playing for the Dallas Cowboys.
Cooper, what differance does it matter how upset your guy gets when he loses his starting position. Yes it does make a differance, but only if the guy has the skills. Hunter knew he would not be able to win a starting spot against newman and henry. So he basically knows he is not good enough right now to start at cornerback for us, but isn’t willing to start at FS. I say good ridence, but also agree we need some more young guys out there. So in the end we lost a younger guy, but he was also a whiner, so it equals out.
Not sure I like the trade. I hate losing youth on this one and would prefer a pick next year (or this past draft) instead of this trade.
I know depth is needed and this guy will likely bring it but I’d prefer young depth in this case. With Glenn signing a two year deal we now have two guys that will need to be replaced in the near future.
All that said, I still believe in Bill and assume he knows more than I do. OK, strike assume, there’s no doubt he knows more.
We got youth………in the secondary…….too much of it last year for my taste.
Newman and Henry are still young. Williams is young.
Frazier, Thornton, Reeves, Jones, add in the rookie Beirault……..Keith Davis……..that is all youth………..not even going to put Dantzlers name in their…….but he is a great athelete maybe he develops into more than just a special teamer……
Glenn is a better pick up…..than Mickens…..but Mickens if healthy is better rotation than Hunter…….but Pete Hunter had his four years with the Cowboys and could not beat out the likes of Mario Edwards………or any of the other lousy corners we had. Good Riddance!!!!
Frazier and Reeves both showed some signs of figuring out a thing or two. Who had the ACL Thornton?………
I think we actually got a nice mix, Glenn and Mickens bring in experience………Newman and Henry look like starters at CB on any NFL team………and Williams……….if one of our FS plays pretty well great……..if not we can deal with that spot and add another corner or two next years draft……….if we escape the injury bug this year in the secondary we should be very good!!!
Mike - I agree with you in part. If, as you say, “he basically knows that he is not good enough right now to start,” then your’re right, good ridence.
But I was hoping that he didn’t want to play FS because he “knew” he was good enough to start at CB.
In other words, “I’m not playing FS, you are playing FS.”
There is nothing wrong with letting it be known that if the 3rd best cover guy is going to play FS, then it should be either Newman or Henry.
I want a competitor not a cry baby. It seems Hunter was more of the latter unfortunately. Time will tell.
the cowboys are going to have one of the deepest secondary in the league. If Mickens gets injuried this year, at least we have Frazier, who by all means is a solid 4th DB or even a 3rd. If I got one thing from last year, it was that although the young DB’s we had may have struggled last year, this year they will not be asked to start but to come in if there is an injury. The experience they got from last year will be huge for this years team.
Hunter had to go . But I dont understand why evryone is so down on him. He is a young player with alot of ptential, and we replaced him. Im glad we did, but he should want to be with a team that can use him. Everyone wants the best opporunity they can get to grow and advance in their career. Good for him and good for us, everyone wins. We sure are gonna have alot of rebuilding to do in a couple of years though. Im glad these guys want to play for their old coach, but this is a football team, not a retirement home. Still, hunter had to go, and we shouldnt fault him for wanting whats best for himself.
Why didnt we trade him for a fs?
The Jetriots
(in a previous post, I said PatriJets but tht doesn’t seem applicable today).
The Cowboys get a 32 years-old, 5-8, 180 lbs. CB for a 24 years-old (25 in May), 6-2, 208 lbs. CB who could, in theory, play FS with some coaxing and someone in whom, Parcells once saw potential–enough to give him the corner as a sophomore…
evidently, Hunter’s viewed now as someone who can’t be coached, or is just not a Parcells guy, or a thug because it became about the money. While I wouldn’t want a person there who doesn’t want to be, I thought it made better sense to try to raise Pete’s value this season by putting a healthier, more seasoned DB on the trading block. But that’s certainly debatable.
I dunno, it just doesn’t feel right. I trust Bill to make good calls, but I haven’t agreed with them all. Maybe this deal makes more sense in some parallel universe where I’m actually a J-E-T-S Jets, Jets, Jets fan.…
How does our secondary rate across the NFL?
The way I see it, we should be better than 50% of the other teams.
Williams is a pro bowler. Any team in the NFL would take him.
Henry is good but not great.
Newman played at near a pro bowl level his rookie year while basically being left on an island. I’m not sure I can explain his second year however, but like Williams, any team in the NFL would snap Newman up if they could.
Our FS is wide open, but at least we have some depth and veteran leadership at CB with AG. I think AG puts us over the top.
Just focusing on the secondary, where do you expect our team to rank?
Derrick,
Young talent ….. Newman, Johnson, Witten, James, Thorton, Peterman, Rogers, K. Thorton, Ryan, Roy Williams, Crayton, Copper, Julius Jones, Frazier, Jones, Henson, and Reeves.
Add this year’s draft picks …. Ware, Spears, Burnett, Barber, Canty, Pettiti, Beriault, and Ratliff.
Dallas has some good veterans with solid years still in front of them …. Nguyen, Henry, Morgan, Coleman, and Gurode.
That’s what, about 25-30 spots with young talented players? Keyshawn, T. Glenn, A. Glenn, Ferguson, Riveria, Bledsoe, Ellis, Glover, Allen, etc. are still productive players. In the next 2-4 years Dallas will have many opportunities through the draft, through developing young players, and through free agency to replace their production as their skills deminish.
Now don’t get me wrong I would rather keep Hunter, but the guy wants to start at CB. At least we are getting something for him.
Losing Hunter was not a win-win. It was a lose-lose.
He did not have to move him. He was under contract.
I’m disappointed that our coaches couldn’t get him to consider playing safety. Like StarStruck said, we didn’t get even value. We gave up youth, size, and probably speed. How can that be a good deal for us?
The old adage its not what you know as much as who you know. Team chemistry is a difficult thing to create and maintain. We can see how much that meant to the pats - I would think BP is trying to create 2 things: team chemistry/vision and the best talent possible - long term is good but even the best laid plans can fall apart. I like taking care of business first and hope long term folks step up. It is tough to not sacrifice one for the other. Can you imagine trying to wrangel a bunch of millionaires into a cohesive unit that is unselfish? Plus the big-head syndrome of todays atheletes - I say kuddos to BP for be willing to put in almost 24/7.
Hey ladies. Glad to see you are not getting your pantyhose all knotted up! Look, you either a Bill Parcels fan or not. Just hang on to your skirts and let the Boyz play football.
We need to let any and all possible distractions get out of the locker room and letting Pete go is a good idea. Salary cap has destroyed the advantage we have had over the history of this team. Let the old guys play with young guys, it’s about finding the right chemistry. Bill is taking on his old players because he thinks he knows them and the intensity they bring to the table. We have had some slacker players on this team that we don’t need. Let them go. Lets play some football and kick some ass!
Nobody wants the old glory more than me, but this will take time and I trust Bill will help us get there.
Hunter showed some potential but he wasnt going to start over Henry or Newman. We now have depth so they dont have to play every snap and can have a breather once and a while. I didnt like giving up Antonio Bryant, another player with potential but a bad attitude, but he’s better somewhere else. I would have rather got depth at CB then release Hunter and take a salary cap hit in return for nothing. Mickens and Glenn will be in there for 1-2 years, then it’s Fraziers and Thorntons time to shine. Remember we didnt see anything from Thornton bc of the ACL. The Patriots win because they dont have players that constantly bitch and whine about where they play and how much they play. BP and JJ want to win now and thats what they are doing.
Hmmm, seeing a note that Randal Williams may have been released. There’s another young guy that doesn’t look like he’ll be wearing a star. Too bad. Was hoping he could catch the ball at some point in his career.
You see, that’s been my point all along. Every time a jets player goes on the market., Parcells just has to have him. I don’t think this is a good move at all. THE DALLAS JETS! Might as well get used to it as long as the jets have players they can cast off to Dallas.
Don,
Where did you get the information on Randal Williams?
Cooper and StarStruck are on the money.
Sure, we don’t know the details, but from a fan’s perspective we have given up on a bigger, faster, younger guy who 1 year ago was good enough to start for us. I know no team would be willing to give up much to get Hunter as he is coming off his own big injury. BUT this is why we should be dissappointed that our coaching staff was not able to work with Hunter / gave up on Hunter. Perhaps he’s able to perform this off-season / pre-season? Perhaps he’ll grow into a suitable starter, even if not spectacular.
Hunter is physically a real candidate at FS. Whining and crying? Didn’t want to be a S? The only players who can whine are the TOs in the league. Unproven players who whine should just be ignored and told to get their butts back on the field and do as they’re told. I expect our coaching staff to be able to handle that.
I don’t much like how we cast-off “non-parcells” guys for low-impact, low-output players (e.g., Morgan), but…
btw., Randal Williams is someone I don’t mind releasing. He didn’t show anything to us fans when he was on the field. No offense to him, but he coudn’t do it.
hope Randall is not the next jimmy smith……..how did we ever let that guy go
Same here, Jon. I’m not 100% comfortable with that move. I know he hasn’t shown up yet, but he might turn up big for someone if we have let him go. We’ll see.
What, they didn’t couldn’t find a WR rehabbing from major knee surgery to trade for? What about some old guy? Uh oh, isn’t there a former Patty WR floating around out there unsigning?
“It’s OK, Troy, just stay calm. We’re going to lower a rope down to you and I want you to to grab a hold…”
I really wish I could fix my typos after posting. I’d swear that word–didn’t–wasn’t there when I submitted it.
By the way, all we have to do is find out which WR the jets no longer want to find out who our next pickup will be.
Jimmy smith broke each leg in training camp two years in a row.
Randall williams has size and speed, his problems, cant run a crisp route and has hands made out of cement.Sounds like his next job will be with Seattle, would fit in well there, non of their recievers cant catch a cold either.
My concern is with Pete Hunter. This guy has the size and speed and agility your looking for in a corner. He might be the next Jimmie smith, thats what I’m worrying about and I dont say that about too many players that we traded or released. I thought that he finally got his chance to start and played pretty well, if only we had a better defensive line to get some pressure on the quarterback.Even newman had trouble last year covering guys for 10 seconds. I think he is just frustrated with the fact that the injury took him out of the equation.I just hope I’m wrong about him.
Copper and Crayton definitely showed a lot of promise last year…….I do not think it would take much for one of them to replace Q Morgan in the starting line up. Randall has been around the practice squad forever now it seems…….but then again we never know about work ethic and things like that……….sometimes it takes a guy getting cut and getting a fresh start elsewhere to wake up. Still if Jimmy Smith had made it as a Cowboy we would not have been as bad off when Irvin went down……..Galloway Ismail and the other bunch did not impress me. At least ex patriots and Jets Keyshawn and Glenn have solidified the WR positions. Galloway has another 500 yard year in TB last year………compared to the kid Gruden could not coach. KJ
When we go 11-5 this season and are a force in the playoffs I think all of this talk about the Dallas Jets will stop. We are going to be real good this year. We have Antonio Bryant, that was a mistake. But Parcells knows what hes doing. He been around the game forever and knows how to win. I question some of his moves but have faith in him. He didnt come to Dallas to screw up our team, he came to win us another Super Bowl. Too many teams try to compare themselves to the Pats. The Pats are doing something that may never be done again. If you win one you are considered a great team. We have a good mix of young players with talent and didn’t need Pete Hunter. The guy didnt show me that much last year, or the year before that. Frazier will be fine and will be better in years to come. Any CB that go to the Jets usually suck anyway
Okay Lou, I get what you’re saying about BP, but you have to admit that the guy is more than a little biased towards his former players. I’m not saying that some of them are not worth it, but every time I turn around, there is some Jet player (and occasionally a Patriot) being brought into Dallas. There are going to be mistakes (Antonio Bryant), but we can’t just run away from real talent just because there is some Jet palyer out there that Bill coached way back when.
I’m sorry, but I have a real problem with trading a 24 year old with speed for a 32 year old who will play the same position with no guarantee that he’ll be any better. We just got a 32 year old in Aaron Glenn. Do we really need another one that badly? I just don’t think so.
Jon
I think the jury is still out on Morgan or it should be. If he works out okay, he’s young enough to contribute over four or five years, playing in tandem with Crayton and Copper. If not, I like either guy in his spot.
I hate going here but if the Cowboys had drafted Randy Moss, Galloway would just have been a bad dream ala my brother Darryl and my other brother Darryl.
So many, too many ifs. If I had a dime for every if, I’d buy the team myself. Actually, I do have this dream–let’s call it a fantasy, where I collect a bunch of dimes, buy the Redskins, move them out of DC to Richmond or Norfolk, change the name, change the colors, change the song and completely erase them from existence. That way, I would no longer have to hear the term Redskins, or “Hail to…†or see those ugly uniforms and I would drive the final nail in the coffins of all the Redskins fans with whom I’ve had to contend in my lifeâ€â€since that day in 1967 when I became star stricken; plus, I’d get to see my Cowboys in person twice a year! (yes, Texas, this is a big thing)
(deep, long sigh) Dare to dream…
No I don’t like trading young guys either but I don’t think that it will be as bad as we seem. I just didn’t see alot of things from Hunter. I know with corners you have to watch them play and not go by stats, but in 2003, he played every game and had 1 int and 6 pass deflections. Frazier played in 12 games last season and had more INTS and double the Pass Deflections. I just think that because Henry, Newman, and Frazier are young, we can give away Hunter for veteran leadership. I agree that I am tired of all these old guys coming in after there prime, but think that Antonio Bryant was a FAR bigger mistake then Hunter.
It’s all moot now. Apparently, the trade is not going to happen. That’s according to Cowboysplus.com
Hunter won’t be traded to Jets
01:02 PM CDT on Thursday, April 28, 2005
By MATT MOSLEY / DallasNews.com
A trade that would send Cowboys cornerback Pete Hunter to the New York Jets in return for veteran cornerback Ray Mickens will not happen, according to Jets general manager Terry Bradway.
Cowboys owner/general manager Jerry Jones could not immediately be reached for comment.
Hunter’s agent, Ray Savage, said the teams were close to completing a trade late Wednesday.
“This trade has never been discussed,” Bradway said through a team spokesman.
The Cowboys signed 32-year-old cornerback Aaron Glenn on Wednesday. Glenn and Mickens had played under Cowboys coach Bill Parcells with the Jets from 1997-99.
It hasnt been reported so maybe Hunter has gotten some of his head straight. The guy could start at FS and play some corner for us. He has potential but instead of getting mad at signing Glenn, could rather learn from him. He was an All American playing S in college and needs to listen to Parcells and move their for the good of the team. Just like the Patriots players do.
Some of you seem to have missed something along the way. Complaining about trading away our youth?? Hunter had more than enough time to show he was worth being drafted where he was. Now we have Frazier, Jones, Reeves and Thornton–all younger than Hunter–and all of whom BP trusts more than Hunter. Oh yea, almost forgot–Hunter would not have play FS–he said it, and BP and Jerry said it–wasn’t goin to happen. The size argument doesn’t work here for Hunter either, cause Beriault is bigger (and has more experience at both spots–they were interchangable in the scheme his school employed, just like ours).
And as for the “Dallas Jets” argument–who on the market is better than KJ, Terry Glenn, Fergusen, or Aaron Glenn (backup) for the money we are paying them??
WR is a non issue–we’re developing two young players, Crayton and Copper, and have signed a couple UFA WRs as well.
And getting a solid backup (Mickens), from whom the plethora of young DBs can learn a lot–such as great work ethic (not Hunter), confidence, and composure–is not what I’d call a bad idea. The fact that he knows BP makes that even better. (actually, all of this applies to Glenn as well)
Look at BP’s past teams–many of his better players were coached (by BP) to be good. That is why we don’t need an immidiate upgrade at WR (who could we get that would come in better than KJ and Glenn?).
The guys that show BP potential will get playing time, but most of the development comes from non-game coaching from none other than the big Tuna himself.
Oh, and by the way–I’m not a Jets fan, but what was their record last year?? Quite a bit better than ours, if I’m not mistaken. So getting guys from there (and from when BP had them in the playoffs) isn’t something to be complaining about. Now if it was, say, the Seahawks, Cardinals, or last years 49ers, then some complaints might be warranted. But have a little faith in Bill–he’s done this before (more than once actually), and if JJ lets him stick around and do his thing (unlike the management of his past few teams), than we all will be very, very pleased.
***TRADE ISN’T GOING TO HAPPEN NOW ANYWAY–buy most of this still applies
Spags is saying exactly what I was saying about this trade not making sense. Hunter’s agent is just stirring sh_t trying to get his guy’s name out there.
I wish you were listening to Mickey Spagnola right now. He’s just repeating the same things I’ve been saying. It’s time to stop brining in all of these FAs and develop some of our own talent before we trade them away and watch them become studs for some other team.
Yeah Glenn before he got hurt last year was putting up big numbers. We need one WR to step up so Glenn can play in the slot and we will be fine. The running game starts the passing game, and if JJ is healthy, we are fine at WR. We payed Glenn a mil a year to serve as a good backup. Thats cheap and a real good deal.
I still think after watching Hunter for a few years he is another Mario Edwards. Go with the mix of good veterans and 3 youngsters in the secondary. As we all know Dallas has been drafting CBs for the past 5 years (I think 10 or 11). Only 1 panned out. It is a vital position that few can master. We can draft 2 more next year to keep the youth approach going with Williams, Newman, and Henry as the future. Veterans can only help the mix.
Anyway it seems that the Jets feel just like me. They know they will be getting the short end of the stick with Hunter.
Hunter should stay a year and play at FS if he wants his stock to improve and sign with another team next year. The guy hasnt proved anything and doesnt have enough credibility to demand a trade.
Jeez, why all the whining about Hunter? To use the argument that he started just a year ago doesn’t carry much weight. He started by default - not because he proved what a good player he was. Just remember back to before the season started. All the so-called experts were already saying how much trouble we were in because of the secondary and his was the name they were talking about being the biggest question mark. Like others have said, he had four years to prove himself and couldn’t win the job against weaker players. Then, when he goes down with a season-ending injury, instead of getting himself ready to play and doing what was best for the team, he says he has no intention of playing safety. Those of you complaining that the coaches didn’t do enough shouldn’t kid yourself. They know every time these guys take a dump. Don’t think they weren’t working on him for FS. They have to know where they stand with every player before going into the draft. Instead of getting himself ready to prove himself, he starts dictating his career path. This guys has done absolutely nothing in 4 years to dictate ANY demands. He’s now going to a team that lost most of it’s good players to us. He’ll be lucky if he’s not sacking groceries in two years. My God, it’s not like we’re talking about a rookie with a lot of untested potential. Major knee surgery has ended more careers in this game than any other injury. Other than RB, CB is the worst position to come back from a major knee injury without losing a step or some ability to do the cutting necessary. Zimmer has been around this guy long enough to know if he was good enough to compete for a CB spot. If he was going to be a contributor, then he should have proven it.
If you’re going to be a cancer on a team, you’d better have some ‘A’ game to back up your words before they cut you out. That’s exactly what happened and it was certainly justifiable. I don’t think Bill even puts up with that from a big a cancer as TO. He would just find a second-tier reciever and a slew of draft picks and pull the trigger with the ol’ Herschel Walker trick.
G Man,
There is a big difference in between Hunter and Edwards. Its 4.4 speed compared to 4.6 speed. Before the injury Hunter could flat out fly. That’s why Bill was thinking he would be servicable at CB, that and his size. Mario also had good size, but just doesn’t have the speed to compete in the NFL as a full time starter.
David,
If I’m not mistaken, Hunter was not drafted. He was UDFA signing out of VA Union.
I think most people here are responding to the quantity influx of Parcells’ former player, not so much to their quality. In fact, only a couple have not panned out. In Bill we trust. And while Mickens is now a moot point, he had nothing to do with the Jets success last season. He was injured.
I don’t like the trend I’m seeing. What bothers me is that we are setting a precedent for allowing players to get out of a contract by having a hissy fit. If someone’s not on-board, all they have to do is a little complaining and we accomodate them. Hunter was under contract to play football - if he needs to play safety to help the team, he should have been told to enjoy it and shut up. Instead, he cries and we make a short-sighted trade to get rid of the problem. Fifth round draft choices shouldn’t be calling the shots.
Further, I doubt Mickens is being paid at the minimum. So we got a 32-year old, injured undersized corner making starter’s money for a 25 year old, injured, pain-in-the-butt, but oversized corner-who-could-play-safety making 5th round money. Its a bad deal. The difference in money could have bought us a decent right tackle. Or we could have traded for a right tackle.
I think Hunter was a 4th rounder. I personally don’t remember, but I think I’ve heard others here say that.
He wasnt a 1st rounder with a huge abundance of talent which you guys make it seem like. He never proved himself to be good and is coming off a serious injury. Id rather trade him for something instead of flat out releasing him. He might not even make the roster with Thorton coming back from injury. CB’s–Henry, Newman, Glenn, Frazier, Thorton, Jones, Reeves. Theres your 6.
Dave,
Hunter may very well be a cancer. Only time will tell. I don’t think he has proven to be that just yet, but for crying out loud, why bring in another 32 year old corner who with no chance of building for the future? I just don’t get it.
dave:
Hunter was a 5th round selection in 2002 from Virginia Union.
Hunter is going to be a free agent next year, and I’m betting that with both newman and henry signed to longterm deals and now with glen playing the nickel, hunter is not going to re-sign with the cowboys.
And after refusing to help the team out and play free safety I doubt the cowboys would even try to re-sign him. I think hunter has some talent, but it’s not like he the next Ty Law.
And I don’t want a player on my team, a 5th round pick by the way, who wont do everything he can to help the team. It would be one thing if he had shown that he can be starting CB in the NFL, but he has shown nothing but a few flashes of potential. And he thinks we should have just gone into the season without signing a top corner and just trust that his knee is 100% and that he’s good enough to play the position. PLEASE!!! I don’t want this turd on my team and I’ll take an injured nine year vet who has proven his ablility over an injured player who not only hasn’t proven himself but also won’t sacrifice to help his team.
kenny, if I’m not mistaken, Hunter will still be a restrict free agent for one more year.
Kenny, I hear you, but Mickens? Give me a break.
Jets saying the trade is bogus
Raul
Thanks for the assist.
Hunter could not beat out Mario Edwards……
and yes he was from Virginia Union……….a bit tall for a CB but did have good speed……..but again we had this guy for how long…….he finally got his chance…….he gets hurt……and then complains when we ask him to consider a position he also played in College? Hunter should check the average salary of his Virginia Union Graduates or any College Graduate 4 years out of Collge before he complains so much.
This is not a major loss guys……..Glenn is much better to add to the mix…….plus the rookie committee from last year……..i think this is a nice mix of veterans and youth.
Also………..who cares where these guys came from Jets……..Patriots…….at least the guys Parcells brings in are PLAYERS…….that come here for the same money the Jets were offering…….like Jason Ferguson……..if Bill had something to do with our Draft from 95-2000 maybe we would not need all these guys from other squads………
I think we dramatically improved our Defense front 7 and secondary through both the Draft and Free Agency…….we are continuing to sign others………this training camp could produce a very good football team……that has a grea mix of YOUTH………and Veterans……..and I think it will be Playoff Caliber team……..we beat some pretty good teams last year……..and hung in against some great teams……….Minnesota and Pittsburgh could have easily been Victories for us………ok Minn ran away with it in the 4th but………Pitt? They were 15-1 and if Vinny doesn’t give em the ball we win that game.
I think this team is a 10 game winner………or more and the last time I checked that pretty much puts you in the playoffs these days!!!
Julius healthy………1600 yard season……maybe 1500 but do not be surprised if he is in the 1700+ range…….he is going to also catch some balls for a few yards……
Witten will break a 1000 recieving……..my guess he has more than a couple of TDs too…..
Glenn or Key breaks 1000……..probably Johnson……but Glenn is going to be Drews favorite deep threat…….so maybe he as a few less yards and a few more TDs…..
Drew throws for 3000+ yards………and hope he controls INTs better than Vinny
We add a few sacks, a few ints, some fumble recoveries and we are going to be a very good football team. Somebody on this squad is going to decide they want to be a starting Tackle in the NFL…….and we got a football team here. A very quickly improved one………….look at the skill positions and we got quality guys………a great start with Witten, Jones, and some of the younger guys on the Oline……..some guys that need to step up like James, and Kalen Thornton, but some youth in there too with Burnett and Ware……Nguyen is going to love having guys like Spears, Ware, and Ferguson to go along with Glover and Ellis………
Lets run the tables on the NFC East………How bout them Cowboys!!!!
my only complaint last year of Parcells is when the season was pretty much in the bag the last few games Henson could have taken a few snaps in the NFL………..with Jones on the field we were improving…….it would have been nice to see him get a few. In the end, he did it his way and stuck with Vinny…….but hey……Henson is supposedly working his but off and he does not cost us any money like Eli, or Losman where we HAVE to play him or cut him…….
Jon,
The reason Mario was let go was because Parcells thought Hunter was if not an upgrade at least the same. So did he beat him out in a training camp? No, but in a way by letting Mario go to another team he beat him out.
I agree with Jon about giving Henson a few more snaps last year. Hell, the season was over, and Parcells still wouldn’t budge on Vinny. That was my biggest problem with him. Let’s hope that changes this year.
Hey, guys it’s official, richie anderson and randall williams are cut. It’s also true about the hunter/mickens trade and should happen this afternoon. check it out in http://www.dallascowboy.com
sorry about the website, try this one instead, http://www.dallascowboys.com/home.cfm?screensize=small
this trade is all speculation according to dallascowboys.com’s Mickey Spagnola. He says that the only person that has been throwing this rumor around is Hunter’s agent, & it is an attempt to get something going for his client.
No where on the offical site does it say anything at ALL about mickens & hunter trade. check it out again………..
Good. I hope it doesn’t happen.
Rob2, maybe cancer was a bit harsh, but he was definitely headed down that road without an attitude change. First and foremost, the guy had to prove he was worthy. He had an opportunity to very likely start at the only position he was going have a shot at - FS. Henry was signed for too much money to move him out of his position. Newman will likely return to the near-shutdown CB he was now that he’ll have some help. And Roy is Roy. For all we know, this whole thing could have been a test to see what his reaction would be to being asked to take one for the team. Now we know. I think there was little doubt that he wasn’t going to start at CB without playing way beyond what he ever showed when he was healthy. After 4 years, he loses the luxury of being called one of the young guys with potential. By many people’s standards, if a player hasn’t made his mark in the league by year 3 or 4 , most times, he’s just another role player who could be out of football in a year or two. Sure there are exceptions, but that’s not the rule.
Hmmm, if this is all his agent I can’t imagine that’s going to sit well with the Big Man (BP).
Enjoy training camp Mr. Hunter, it’s going to be a tough one.
I think we all need to take a chill pill. If Hunter gets traded, it’s because he is a whiney cry baby who Parcells doesn’t want to deal with. If he doesn’t get traded, it’s because the Cowboys feel that he is a valuable commodity that is worth way more than the 32 year old Mickens. I don’t look at this potential trade as a way for Parcell to accumulate more of his old players. It’s just a chance to rid the team of a potential problem and receive something, a known commodity, in return. No one is saying that Mickens is guaranteed a spot on the team or that he’ll even be around for more than a year. Just a chance to pick up a player who will help balance veteran leadership with the infusion of youth we currently have on the roster. Hello everyone, we had 4 rookie CBs on the roster last year.
Regarding Randall Williams…at what point is he going to prove he can play WR in the NFL. He is going into his 4th or 5th year and he has only caught 1 pass in his entire career. While it does seem he should have been given more of an opportunity, I would imagine the coaching staff has a much better idea than any of us as to whether the guy can actually play. Patrick Crayton has caught more career passes than Williams and he’s only been on the team for a year. We have plenty of young WRs on the team that have a lot more potential than Randall Williams (Williams having shown his potential), so let’s give them a try and see if any of them shake out.
Excellent pt Gene.
Anyone wanna bet on how long it takes Al Davis to get Williams in camp with that speed of his?
He’s following in Alexandar Wright’s footsteps.
As for the comparisons to Jimmy Smith, you’ll recall not only did Dallas cut him and the Eagles cut him, but that he was out of football for a year before he latched on with the startup Jaguars.
fast != good and stop comparing every cut receiver to Jimmy Smith.
Just because you run fast does not make you a football player. Williams has never produced. The Cowboys should have charged Williams a price of a ticket because all he did during his time here was wath others score. I am not counting the fluke t.d. he had on the on sides.
I don’t like it fellas Hunter can play he’s big and fast and physical he just needed to tighten his coverage skills a little and that would come with PT I think we took an L on this one especially for a 9yr vet on a bad wheel the first time I see TO or Plexiglass go over Henry or Glenn I’m gonna think about Hunter
guys enough with it…it aint happening….
becuase randall willians was cut doesnt mean he wont be back, the dude was clock at 4.04 40yd according to http://www.dallascowboys.com, thats damn fast. speed doesnt always mean catches though see keyshon slow but can catch anything you throw at him, bp knows what hes doing, so im not worried about randall, bigger fish to fry…
we need something new to talk about, rafeal???
Anyone else tired of reading about randall and hunter — two players who never had any impact for our team (ok, maybe some — thanks randall for the TD against the Eagles — but we still lost)
Onto more important things — I’ve heard / read little about the ‘boys UFA class. I recall last year that we had some marquee names on our list, including Tucker who was expected to be a 2-3rd rnd draft choice. Who are the marquee guys this year and why don’t I see an safeties on the list?
Any comments?
One comment caught my eye so I have to ask this. An earlier post said Hunter is too tall to play safety. WTF? I had an ongoing discussion last night about Glenn playing safety, but was told he’s too short. Again - WTF? We seem to have a lot of opinions about who can play where, but I still say the 4 best DBs will be on the field - Henry, Newman, Glenn, and Roy. This is assuming there are no more signings other than role players. Some of the guys mentioned earlier are not likely to even make the team this year. We appear to have a lot of depth, but there is a limit on how many players the team can carry. Some are going to be caught in a numbers game. AG signed here for one of three reasons. 1) He’s either going to play FS (I don’t care how short he is. He was able to play man coverage as a CB where heighth is more of a factor and still made the Pro Bowl twice), 2) he just really, really likes playing for Bill, or 3) there is some thinking to move one of the other CBs to FS and put AG at CB. One of the most common position changes in football is to move a CB over to FS as he ages or a more talented or younger CB comes in. It happened last year when the Texans drafted Dunta Robinson and moved Marcus Coleman over to safety. I still don’t think AG came here to just play nickel when he could have done that in his hometown where his family and friends are and didn’t really want to leave anyway. I think he will slide over to the nickel in passing situations though assuming he’s not playing CB already. I realize Glenn isn’t the prototypical FS, but to say Hunter is too tall, I just don’t get that one at all. When most of the elite receivers in the league are 6-3 or better, heighth is not a disadvantage unless he’s a gangly, uncoordinated 8 footer and I haven’t heard about that. That’s like saying a LB is too tough. It’s a good thing. I’m not trying to sound like an ass. I would just like to hear the reasoning on that comment as well as others. I think I know a little about the game, but I’m always willing to learn more.
By the way, as I think most everyone here knows, the 3-4 defense is designed to stack the line and pressure the QB from (let’s call it) the Ware position. And when Roy sneaks up to blitz, that means the DBs will be in coverage more which is another reason why I think there is a better than average chance of Glenn being on the field. His coverage skills are better than anyone else on, possibly, the entire roster. I just think from the signings and the draft, they are planning some severe pressure and AG will mean one more good cover guy to make a play on the ball on a pass play. From what I’ve read here (and I don’t go back and read everything) this seems to be an idea evenly divided. Most of what I’ve seen that don’t agree only say it’s not going to happen or he’s too short. I’d be interested in hearing sound arguments as to why you don’t think it will happen.
(I reserve the right to change my mind if a true FS is signed or if I’m wrong).
And since this thread is mostly about Hunter, I’d like to see those defending his abilities say why they feel this way because he has absolutely no body of work to compare to. It would be great if I were wrong and he turned into a Pro Bowl player, but I don’t see where some of you guys are saying what a good player he is when he has done nothing to warrant that praise in four years of play.
Again, not trying to step on anyone’s toes, but most of the discussion here doesn’t have a lot of people listing their arguements to support their position. You may disagree with my belief that Glenn will be FS, but I at least give you my arguments for why I believe that.
Just trying to generate some more detailed and intense discussion …
Carioca
According to the Ranch Report, the Cowboys signed Northwestern safety Dominique Price as UDFA.
Did anyone notice the move of Tom Crowder from S to WR? That’s interesting.
Rafael,
Our you going to permit the foul language from DERRICK?
Is this something that cowboys organization would approve of on a blog??
Please respond
Dave,
Hey what’s up? We had a nice little tennis match going on another thread, but you never responded back to me. …. Same subject, kinda.
Dave,
Hunter sucks and he is down the toilet anyway.
I said he was a bit tall and perhaps a little lanky for Corner…….which might have contributed to his injury. Pro scouts have a pro size that works at certain positions. Absolutely people have proven them wrong………Darryl Green, Sam Mills, Dat Nguyen, Zach Thomas………
but some of what the issue is about is if a player is too tall he takes different hits………..for example Mike Williams and Matt Jones are both a bit taller than what the pros would like to see……… that 6′1-6′4 inch size with speed and agility……….example Michael Irvin had that pro body at the WR spot. Above average strength, good speed, great hands. Obviously there are exceptions. Randy Moss is a bit tall and also has freakish speed……..but sometimes guys get dropped due to their height. One player that comes to recent memory is Eddie George. Although George was a pretty good pro for a number of years, his height was most likely a disadvantage at the RB position.
Hunter acted like a spoiled brat. Hunter had a chance to play CB, FS whatever……….regardless of size……. See ya Hunter………
I like Aaaron Glenn on the Field on 3rd down no matter what position he plays……..i would not be surprised to see him rotate in as an FS occassionlly if……we are staying in a true 3-4 on a longer passing down……..
Josh,
Mario and Hunter were on the same TEAM……..and Mario Started over Hunter. Look it up. Parcells did not resign Mario cuz he figured it was time for Hunter or somebody to step up and he thougth TB was overpaying Edwards…….which it looks like they did………and he did not forsee us losing Woodson………who was stronger in coverage than Roy Williams.
Dave here are some statistics. I’ve been doing some research on FS and SS around the league according to the team rosters and depth charts. Here is what I have gathered. Of all the players on NFL rosters to include this years draftees, only 3 FS/SS are shorter than 5′11″ their heights are 5′9″ from Baltimore, 5′9″ from Detroit, 5′8″ from Pittsburgh, and 5′8″ from Indianapolis. And of those only Bob Sanders from Indianapolis is a starter but he does weigh 206 lbs. I also noticed that most starting FS/SS are 6′0″ to 6′3″ tall. There could be a reason why Glenn might not fit into being a FS for us but I wouldn’t complain if he is since we need the best playmakers out on the field and I would say that Glenn will be a playmaker for this team. I would hope that Glenn plays in the nickel but using him to cover one of the wideouts and move either Henry or Newman to cover the slot. I would really like to see BP play the rookie Berriault at FS. Many people had him projected as a 2nd or 3rd rounder in this draft so just because he happened to fall into our laps with a 6rd pick doesn’t mean that he can’t produce as a 2nd or 3rd rounder. Maybe he is this years Parcells hidden gem that he usually gets with a 6th round pick. Tell me what you think.
I meant to say 5′10″
lilbeat……..I am hopeful Beirault can play FS…….but the book on him says if you get behind him it is 6 points. He looks more like a SS, but hey……..if he can play it………great. The offensie Tackle and the Defensive Tackle could be secret studs too. Pettiti shut down Dwight Freeney…….who if he did not lead the NFL with sacks last year was pretty close. If he can do that in the pros he might be the best option on our team at Right Tackle.
I do think he will be an immediate Special Teams stud……the likes of which we have not seen since the days of Bill Bates or Gant……….I think he will bring the wood on kickoffs right away. We lost another great special teams player, as well as LB……….Dexter Coakley. That guy was also one heck of a football player.
if you get behind most fs its 6 pts though right???
Jon,
I think you just reitterated what I said.
Chadd,
What???? I’m confused about the Derrick stuff. First off, I don’t see it. I’ve been away from the blog most of the day and am not aware of it. I generally don’t give too much leeway to flamers, but again, don’t see it.
Lastly, I have no connection to the Cowboys organization. And I’m not sure I would want one.
Rafael,
Great Blog. Keep up the good work.
GO COWBOYS!
As a Jets fan, this was an interesting proposition… from my end, I am not sure what to think about it.I wonder who is telling the truth.. the agent or Bradway