The Case for Nose Tackle
Posted: April 25, 2008 @ 1:10 pm
…there is talk about [Marcus] Spears being moved out of the lineup and possibly off the team via a draft-day trade. The Cowboys are contemplating moving Jason Hatcher into the starting lineup as well as moving nose tackle Jay Ratliff back to end, according to a source.
— Clarence Hill, Ft. Worth Star-Telegram, April 25th
If the team does this, who is left to man the nose? Tank Johnson and nobody else. The Cowboys have Ratliff and Stephen Bowen to play inside when the team goes to a four man line on passing downs, but Bowen was pushed around last pre-season when he was tried over center.
We’ve been saying it for weeks — this team needs to get bigger and stronger on the nose. They could also use an upgrade at LE cause the yards per attempt was higher for plays run at Spears last year than it was for plays run at RE Chris Canty.
If Spears does get a new address, and even if he doesn’t, look for guys like Iowa State’s Ahtyba Rubin and Texas A&M’s Red Bryant starting at the end of round three.
– Going With the Devil I Know
I’ll be camping out tomorrow at The Tavern, 12th and Lamar, just a stone’s throw from House Park Stadium, where the football scenes for Friday Night Lights are often taped. I like the menu and the layout. I’ll be upstairs from about 1:30 on. Can’t say I can stay all day but I should be good for the first round. Look for me; I’ll be the guy with the Cowboys cap and the Marvin the Martian t-shirt.
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Maybe they should have kept Fergy.
hey friends,
guess what!!!
the Sports Xchange has us taking Chad Henne with no. 28!
YES!!!
New SI Mock:
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/don_banks/04/25/mock.draft7.page3/index.html
That’s why I like the sleeper pick of Calais Campbell along with Red and Phillips.
Throw in a Roy Williams trade and you’ve got your first day.
Just say no to RB & drafted WRs in the 1st round.
Did anyone hear TNew talking to Michael Irvin? I only caught the tail end of it and Michael and Kevin Kiley sounded like Newman was none too happy about Pacman. Can anyone fill us in?
Now NT makes sense! Give me a space-eater in between Canty and Ratliff.
Can Kentwan Balmer play NT? He’s 6-4, 310 lbs. Size is similar to Tank who is 6-3, 300 lbs. He’s a guy I see going from #15 - 25 in mocks. If he slipped to #28, would he be a consideration?
falcon,
I would not be suprised by a Henne selection.
Yeah Henne will push us right over the top. Then in 2 tears if Romo struggles we can have a QB controversy and spend all day fighting on here about it.
Back up QBs are older veterans because they require less prep time during the week than young guys and starters dont have to be looking over their shoulders. A back up QBs real job is not to win games but not lose them. Besides, Romo needs to come to the sideline and find a smart veteran looking to help not take his job. If we lose our starter for all practical purposes the season is done. Yes, Cash I know about Hostettler and a few other backups too. Save the exception.
Dont get me wrong I would love a flyer on a 5th or 6th rounder. Voach him up, give us depth and then trade him for a 3rd or 4th rounder. Saw GB do it and they always aquired a few better picks.
If we take Henne at 28 its because someone is trading with us and it hasnt been announced yet.
http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/2008/writers/don_banks/04/25/mock.draft7.page3/index.html
New SI Mock
If Henne is on the board at 28 Dallas can auction the pick to Miami, Kansas City and whichever of Atlanta and Baltimore didn’t get Matt Ryan.
It would be great for Dallas, but not as a pick. They would benefit more trading him.
and let me add I would love it if Dallas had the chance to bid him up. The Chiefs and Falcons are loaded with extra picks.
True Raf, but for some crazy reason I am preparing for a big shock (in some way).
I’ll add that I’m VERY HOPEFUL that exact scenario will come to pass tomorrow.
I’m fearful that San Diego at 27, with no other picks until round 5, will be itching to move back for more picks.
Seattle could similarly be looking to trade back as the value on the board at 25 doesnt seem to match up well with their needs.
I’ve been advocating a trade down from 28 for a while. But the more I’m learning, the more I’m realizing that we may not be able to. Not because teams aren’t moving up to take a QB. But because they’re doing it at picks before 28.
I wouldn’t mind a big NT, it just seems like there aren’t very many of them worthy of drafting the last couple of years.
I like Okam as a NT also.
why…
Ahtyba Rubin Iowa St. 6-3 315 5.22
YR__G__TKL_TFL_SKS
07__12_42__4.0_1.5
Tot_24_76__8.0_2.5
Red Bryant Texas A&M 6-41/8 318 5.04
YR__G__TKL_TFL_SKS
07__13_46__6.0_1.0
Tot_45_127_14__5.0
Frank Okam Texas 6-41/2 347 5.29
YR__G__TKL_TFL_SKS
07__12_49__10__5.0
Tot_49_156_27__10.0
Production and size is just better. He was also in the same confrence as Red and in a tougher confrence than Rybin. You can argue that Red had less talent around him but the other DT on A&M (Henry Smith) is a high rated prospect than Derick Lokey from Texas.
I wouldn’t be suprised to see the Chiefs go Clady and Henne with their two number ones.
trade 22 for a team that needs Brhom and trade 28 for a team that needs henne. this would translate to some high value. I would not mind passing on stewart, phillips, felix and others in that ragne if it ment more picks in the mid to high 2nd. There is a lot of value there.
Becho - If Dallas traded both #1s we could probably walk away with 3 additional 2nd round picks and a 1st rounder next year.
I wouldnt have a problem with that because I’m not crazy about the 1st round talent that will probably be there: Felix, Cason, DeSean, etc.
Becho,
Iowa St.’s in the Big 12 too.
What time does the draft start? Rafael mentioned he would be at the Tavern at 1:30 but I thought the draft started sometime in the evening.
Can we please get off of the Red Bryant train please.
man…
If hes’s there at the end of rd 3, then perhaps he’s worth a shot. no earlier.
“Down at the combine, we need to take all them f***ing watches away from those scouts.”
– Bill Parcells to Wade Phillips
Falcon Punch,
What’s the problem? I have him going at the bottom of round three. That’s where he landed on the composite board, at 90. I don’t see anybody here advocating Dallas take him higher.
And what does a stop watch have to do with a nose tackle? None of those guys run under 5.2
Okam would be good value and is a good kid from what i hear. We can fix this first thing Sunday I suspect.
If we select Henne, Owner Jones will fire GM Jerry.
Rafael-
I am a little surprised that you take Gosselin’s word as gospel.
I know the basis is that he supposedly talks to GM and scouts but I would say the same thing if I was trying to market my TOP 100.
This could easily be a case of marketing not fact.
Now, I have no idea who he talks to and who he doesn’t and there is no way he’ll write those names down.
His work is like everyone else’s. It is fun to read but I take it as a grain of salt.
Felix Jones is ok….just ok.
I wouldn’t take him in the first round. I simply wouldn’t do it. Why would I take Jones with a one when I believe Rice will be a better RB with a 2nd round pick.
I just do not believe its a pick of value if it takes a 1 to get Felix Jones.
Id take Stewart in the first. I’d even take Chris Johnson in the first because of his receiving skills.
donny,
because Gosselin’s been posting his top 100 for years and its been the most accurate piece of data published. It’s far better at telling you where a guy is likely to go than any of the draft books.
He was off last year but in most years he’s as close to “gospel” as you’re going to get. He’s earned his reputation.
Jason Taylor for a #1. No way.
Jason Taylor for a #2. Now Way.
Jason Taylor for Greg Ellis. No Way.
Jason Taylor for Marcus Spears. Some may say yes but I say no due to age.
Jason Taylor for Bobby Carpenter. No Way.
In my mind, Jason Taylor is worth a 4rth.
I’m fairly intrigued with picking a FB this year. Here are the top 4 as per Gosselin’s rankings:
1. Jacob Hester (LSU)
2. Peyton Hillis (Arkansas)
3. Jerome Felton (Furman)
4. Owen Schmitt (W. Virginia)
Now, I’ve heard plenty about Schmitt, and Hillis seems to be popular too. However, can anyone share their thoughts about Hester or Felton? Or whether anyone thinks FB is greater need than NT?
Why is Red Bryant so much better than Okam-no one thought that 1 year ago-Okam late is asteal
Jason Taylor is still really good. The Fins are really gutting the leadership on their team after letting Z. Thomas go. Play Taylor opposite Ware and rotate him with Spencer = 3 great years. That said, we really have no need for him, but he should be good for another team on the brink.
Spears is a cheap starter and plays the run fairly well. I thought he had his best year last year. I don’t get trading him.
Raf,
HAha… I was reading a mock that had red in the mid 2nd. I just decided to randomly vent.
About the quote…
It applies becaues people look at Red’s measuralbes and think he’s a player. It’s about measurables, not simply speed.
i would trade spears for taylor any day..
another 1st rounder gone.. Marcus Spears.. I had high hopes for him and I think this year may be his break out year.. if not well..
Hopeful prediction–
Trade 1-22 & Akin for either R. Williams or A. Bouldin
Trade 1-28 to ATL for their 2-34 & 2-37
2-34 Jones-RB-ARK
2-37 Cason-CB-ARIZ
3-92 Johnson-DB-ARK ST
5-163 Okam-DT-TEX
http://stations.espn.go.com/stations/espn1033/archive?id=3208681
I haven’t heard Newman on Irvins’ show, but the podcast is on that page
falconPUNCH:
Dude, Bryant’s measurables aren’t what has him as 1st day prospect, it’s film, the guy is a prototypical 3-4 NT.
His measurables actually hurted him, he isn’t a fit in many teams and that’s why they looked and worked him at Guard.
I would rather see Dallas take a CB that can improve our pass defense at #22. Maybe Talib is still available. Then, at #28, try to trade down with a team needing a QB. If that is not possible, then draft for speed. Take either Felix Jones or Desean Jackson. If all these players are gone, draft the best player available.
“Did anyone hear TNew talking to Michael Irvin? I only caught the tail end of it and Michael and Kevin Kiley sounded like Newman was none too happy about Pacman. Can anyone fill us in?”
I listened to it. Newman didn’t seem upset are bothered. He seemed to have a realistic concept of Pacman. He said something to the effect that if Pacman comes in and plays well and stays out of trouble then (Newman) has no problem with him. He said that some people where upset about it, but then he said that that was the samw with TO so it really doesnt matter. What matters is what Pacman does now.
hey folks… something to consider… Cincy needs help at DT… Could Spears plus a package of picks be going to Cincy for Johnson?…
maple syrup,
If they aren’t taking the Redskins’ offer, then let us forget about Johnson.
just wishfull thinking on my part…
One name I keep hearing is Roy Williams. .. I wouldn’t mind seeing him with a star.
agreed… he’s a freak!
I’ve decided that all the talk about picking an RB in rd. 1 is just a smokescreen.
We all know that good RB’s can come from much later in the draft.
they do this draft right, and get a guy like Roy Williams, Pacman plays, we fill a couple needs with hits and this is a Superbowl winning team.
mlittle
That kind of thinking is what gave us Julius jones instead of Steven Jackson.
Does anyone have a legitimate feel for the chances that Terry Glenn will play this year? That could influence the draft.
I still sort of have it in the back of my mind that JJ will make a trade for McFadden… I don’t necessarily favour that but I can’t ignore the possiblity…
Well, I wasn’t willing to say anything else on Felix Jones but EricR asked me to elaborate on why do I like him right now.
First thing first, one month ago I used to cringe everytime that I saw the team linked to Felix Jones because they put it this way: “He’s a razorback, just like Jerry Jones”. I also knew that he isn’t known for doing something after 1st contact and how his spread Offense in College helped him some. And then I realized, most good RBs in College are helped by their schemes and most of the time those won’t help in the NFL.
I also started to see his positives, he’s probably the back with the best set of eyes, he didn’t took every play outside, that statement’s false. Most of his highlights come from plays in which he took the ball outside, yeah, but some come from broken down plays in which he read, reacted and had the speed to take the ball outside. That’s Marion Barber kind of vision. And when his Offense opened lanes for him, he hitted the hole real fast. That’s Julius Jones kind of quickness in his 2004 form.
I’ve also heard his comparisons with Reggie Bush and jeesh, I may look bad right now but I have a girlfriend and I know that my manhood is in real solid ground, that’s a really bad comparison. Look at photos and highlights, look at his legs and mid section (butt, waist and gut), it’s easy to see that Felix Jones carried more weight and that means that he has potential to have more power. He’s already at 207 pounds and it would be easy to see him weighing 215 in the season opener.
In the end, the guy has really good vision and has the hips to move his body accordingly to what his eyes see and has speed. That’s exactly what our team needs, they don’t need someone that’s lightning fast, or though, they need someone that can read, react and make plays.
I keep hearing people saying that if we just fill this hole or that need we’ll be a “Super Bowl winning team.” Lest we all so quickly forget, examine the last team to actually win the Super Bowl. Holes along the offensive line? Check. Aging/injured WRs? Check. Lack of athletic linebackers? Check. Lack of star-power at RB? Check. Holes in the secondary? Check, check, and check. Look, you don’t need to have a complete team to win it all. You need solid play from most spots, and then some major impact plays from a few others. Get on a roll, and voila. So sure, the Dallas roster has some holes at WR, RB, and CB, but that’s not a prescription pad for the draft. We might instead end up with a Safety, a Guard, and a DT, or even an inside linebacker, and if those guys are impact players, I’m happy.
Filling holes is for fantasy football. Drafting playmakers is what the NFL draft is all about.
BTW, Fighter brought the point on how the Broncos haven’t been willing to Draft a RB high and how they just pluck in talent in later rounds.
Is that a comment on how good the run blocking of their OLine used to be or what? In the last 2 seasons their running stats has been down to average levels and that has a whole lot to do with how their OLine is breaking down to pieces. That and that they had to sign a broken down player like Travis Henry to a good amount of dollars deal because they didn’t had anything at RB…
I don’t know about you, but their philosophy might change, and they’re in position to land the RB of their choice in the 1st Round.
Chandus
A number of the so-called experts have Jonathan Stewart going to Denver. I,too, had heard that Shanahan said he would not draft a RB in the first round.
Great White,
Plex is aging as aWR? No. And he worked through his injury as if it wasn’t there.
Lack of Athletic LB’s? Really? Did you watch Kavika Mitchell play Dallas and NE in the playoffs? Antonio Pierce played like an All Pro in the game against Dallas and the game against NE.
I just think everyone underestimated this Giants team, and their all world attack on the Front D Line just gained confidence after they let Dallas Beat themselves.
The Giants were a very good team, that came together at the right time.
AzCowboy:
Actually, it wouldn’t surprize me if after the Draft it’s filtrated that Mendenhall was part of their short list of BPAs with their pick. I don’t think that Stewart fits what they like as well.
Becho,
Okam has huge size like the Chargers NG.
You ain’t moving him.
I’m all for Okam and I think he will be selected higher than the mocks have him drafted.
I hope we get him.
Raf, I hope for your sake Tex doesn’t show up.
I have to go spend time with my wife tonight since my day is occupied tomorrow. Can’t wait, talk to you all at 3:00 pm.
Get a good night sleep Jerry.
I would love to see Okam picked by the Cowboys. He is difficult to move at the point of attack in the run game but he is an underachiever and does not get much pressure up the field. I would not mind picking up Bryant in the 3rd if he’s there and then if we can get Okam in the 5th I would be very happy with that depth along the D-line.
greatwhite,
I agree with your statement about the Gnats. I’m a bit concerned about Wade Phillips coaching style. We went from Nazi to “do what ever you want, just show up on game day”. I’m not sure that doesn’t have some consequence in December and beyond. Just my opinion but Wade is too slack. I know there are different type coaches in this league and both can win a SuperBowl but I think being too lax can sidetrack a player. Eat, Sleep, Play football during the season.. PERIOD.. nuf said
Did we just trade Akin and Fasano to Miami for a 4th round pick?
Breaking News.. ESPN reported Adam Scheftler reported the Cowboys just traded Akin Ayodele and Anthony Fasano to the Miami for a 4th round pick.
F4,
that’s crazy.. really? holy S#$#
Alantdot, nice to see you posting again. I havent seen/read you in a while. I dont think the Giants were the better team but I do agree they were the team playing better. Its about peaking at the right time.
I guess that gets us back our 4th we traded for PacMan.
Torchindefense,
“do what ever you want, just show up on game dayâ€
C’mon man, Wade mightn’t be as gruff, angry, negative and egotistical as Parcells could be but that doesn’t make him a walk-over. What actual fact can you point to that shows things are that easy at the Ranch? The team has collapsed in December for the last few years, it happened to Parcells and it happened to Wade, maybe we should point the finger at the players.
Also, almost every single player has said the change was great for them. And the proof’s in the season; Wade went 13-3 and that’s the best regular season we’ve had here for about 15 years.
This makes no sense.
Who has a link to this so called trade?
I can’t say I like this latest trade. And I am really beginning to believe that were given away our playerz to the Fins for little compensation. What’s Up Jerry?
Charb. I saw it televised on NFL Network 5 mins. ago..
Akin and Fasano is too much for a 4th round pick, even if it is the first pick in the 4th.
http://cowboysblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2008/04/cowboys-deal-ayodele-fasano-to-dolphins.html
now we need a backup TE as well…I dont think we should have given up Fasano here at all, or if we did then at least get the Fins third rounder.
what’s the cap do now? could this be about more than getting back a 4th..more more about getting another player?
probably frees up some cap space with Akin’s contract.
Trade a Starter and a 2nd round pick for a 4th. I want to vomit.
Jerry’s back and he can’t help himself.
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/8074006/Cowboys-trade-Fasano,-Ayodele-to-Dolphins-
Is that trade for real?
We’re giving up on our 06 Second Round pick already? Wow, what a wasted pick. The Ayodele move makes sense but I’m surprised about Fasano. Well if it is true I think this means the team is really looking at drafting a Fullback this weekend.
It makes sense as Garrett’s offence uses a Fullback more and everyone knows Parcells loves his TE’s. I actually think Fasano will do well when he can play as a normal TE and not that weird H-back/lead blocker type position that we had him doing which seemed clearly unsuited for him. The team obviously was impressed with Curtis last year and probably think he’s cheaper and more athletic and for what they need out of their TE’s (less lead blocking than Parcells offense) he’ll do fine.
So who’s our new Fullback to go with Anderson gonna be? I’m hoping for Owen Schmitt. Now that guy is a lead blocker.
It is the First pick in the Forth isn’t it?
My first reaction was Oh No, but I’m starting to think this could be good.
http://msn.foxsports.com/nfl/story/8074006/Cowboys-trade-Fasano,-Ayodele-to-Dolphins-
This article doesn’t have the return pick or picks.
No we wont need another TE (at least not in the first 4 rounds)
but we will need another Fullback
My guess would be it is more about Dallas going to a predominant 3 wide set. Watch out for that “wow!” player. My guess is Dallas trades for Roy Williams and drafts DeSaun Jackson at the end of round #1.
Guys,
Supreme (but troubled admittedly) talents like Hall of Famer Randy Moss and CB Pacman Jones get traded for Forth Round picks. What do you expect to get for an average linebacker and a backup TE??? The First pick in the Forth Round is fair.
Charb,
we could look at it this way - Akin was probably gone anyway (he would probably have been traded or cut due to the log jam at ILB) also Fasano really hasnt played like a 2nd round pick and in return we get almost a 3rd round pick (1st in 4th).
I guess thats looking at it in the best possible light. I’m not enthusiastic at all about this trade, but on the bright side, we free up some cap space, get a 4th rounder back (a better one than what were giving up for Pacman) while giving up 2 guys that probably wouldnt have seen a whole lot of playing time for us this year.
Just hope that Tony Curtis can be adequate at backup TE or we’ll need a backup
Jay Glazer from Fox Sports has confirmed the trade with Fasano, but not the return picks.
Lets give Jerry a little benefit of the doubt until everything is settled after the draft. Last year I ridiculed him for drafting a certain kicker by the name of Nick Folk. I said we had gramatica and if he wanted a K he should have taken Crosby. 2 GW kicks and a Probowl later I’m the one that looks like a fool
I don’t have a problem with Akin being moved. Why dump a 2nd round TE in a TE friendly offense?
This deal makes no sense to me.
Even if you use the 4th rounder on a guy like Okam, why over pay?
I think we’ll trade one of the first round picks for R Williams or C Johnson and take the best available RB with the other pick. Imagine that offense!
charb,
Ayodele isn’t a starter. Has not been since the day Zack Thomas was signed. He’s a salary dump.
Fasano is the backup TE, entering the last year of his contract. You get something in return for him now or get nothing. He was never going to displace Jason Witten. This is a late 2nd for the top pick in the 4th.
What did I write a few weeks ago about Martellus Bennett? He’s going to be a strong consideration at pick 61 now.
Luke,
FYI, I am not the only one wondering if Wade is too soft. I actually like parts of his style but I think he is too loose. You can have a relaxed style to coaching and win but there is a fine line. IMO and some others, Wade crosses that line, that’s all. Come on, in Dec he should have the team focused ONLY on football, not vacations to Mexico and such. I am for the players having fun with the game. Isn’t that what it should be about? These players get millions to play football, they should concentrate only on football during the season. Only NFL football and nothing less. There is an off season and retirement for leisure time, not during the last part of the season IMO.